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11/24/2011 7:50:00 PM
yeah, great but why do you have to announce you're breaking out of a mold? just do it. or do you need the attention?
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11/24/2011 7:47:00 PM
you're a liar or an idiot. many a black kid is received with open arms at those concerts, and just as many white kids get those stares and rude comments at hip hop shows. stp with you bullshit generalizations.
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spiced 10/20/2011 10:34:00 AM
I guess I can see this from many sides. I'm 40 something and the height of my love affair with Hall and Oates predates the height of their popularity, or what I consider their extremely insipid, sappy top 40 period. When I was into them they were actually called 'blue eyed soul'. If I hadn't gotten sick I would have been another black face in the crowd at the Hollywood Bowl concert, I was just thinking it would be different to see the 4th of July fireworks show with 80s pop music instead of John Phillip Sousa or whatever music they usually play, I wasn't thinking that I was going to be an odd black (wo)man out. On the other hand, depending on where and when you grew up, you can definitely be ostracized, scrutinized, suspected, etc for not liking strictly music made by black people for black people. My junior high school was 200% black, but in 1974 and 1975, we were manic fans of some of the cheesiest, most insipid pop music in history, and could sing every song word for word. This was the era of songs like "Seasons in the sun" "Billy Don't be a Hero" "The night Chicago died"--need I go on? We were also listening to the Ohio Players, James Brown, etc--we were open to everything But I know other people from other parts of the country, different socio-economics, younger generations that felt like they had to conform to what were more acceptably "black" tastes
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NYC Whiteboy 10/11/2011 1:22:00 PM
Hate to say it since I like the theme of the piece but you really do just have bad taste....
Very very very few 'white' people of taste ever listened to Hall and Oates...mostly they were mocked as being fey imitators of really awesome 'Black' soul music. And just like Def Leppard and Journey they suck just as much now as they did back then....
Still....your worldview is right: 'Black' and 'White' mean even less in music than elsewhere...the entire history of pop music is one of constant mixing and cross-pollination from everybody and everywhere.
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Gary Rivera 09/22/2011 4:37:00 PM
It just sounds like you have bad taste in music.
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Etchasketchist 09/17/2011 12:30:00 AM
I'm confused. Black people have always loved Hall & Oates. They're old school Philly soul. They've been sampled by hip hop producers since the 80's.
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Lbailey 09/01/2011 7:43:00 PM
O.K., I enjoyed the story but, I HATE it when people sing along. I am not able to attend many concerts because of the cost. I save my cash for an expensive concert ticket to hear an artist; not an amateur. I think it's very rude.
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Music Lover 08/29/2011 9:30:00 AM
Respectfully, so what...?!
Sure, children (and adults) "can be cruel." I knew lots of kids teased for being smart, enjoying school and getting good grades. Guess they should have just "played dumb" to make themselves less of a target, by your logic.
Or maybe, just maybe they learn that it's the other kids (or adults) issue, not theirs...and continue to be exactly who they are....enjoying whatever they enjoy--whether others "get it" or not. We all have to learn the lesson eventually. Master it in childhood--and one is that much better equipped for all the immature adults who think ostracizing others for their differences is appropriate behavior. Face it, this exists in human beings from all walks of life, regardless of their racial background or culture.
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lesley 08/28/2011 11:05:00 PM
nice to see the black girls representing accordingly. i too am black, largely attended white schools and my music taste is all over the place. i love indie rock, i love electronic and i can get down with soul when need be as well. just seen my coworker rock a joy division t-shirt and she too is my sista. so you know... time to break out of this mold we've "been assigned" once and for all.
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08/24/2011 9:26:00 PM
It's easy to say that as an adult. But, she references childhood here. Having the kind of self-confidence and self-assuredness to say "FU" to someone teasing you at that age is difficult. Kids are notoriously mean to each other at times, I experienced the same nonsense she mentions especially growing up in Texas, where people aren't always known for being the most open-minded.
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08/24/2011 9:22:00 PM
I can definitely identify with this as a black girl who was a big fan of the grunge movement in high school in the 90s. However, I find this to be less for a problem today as hip-hop artists cross over into rock, the whole rap-rock movement with Korn and Limp Bizkit and the fact that there are more and more black artists performing in genres where the majority of performers are white. I have to admit that I'm surprised to see this topic coming up again. I saw plenty of white and Asian people at a Lil Wayne concert I attended in Houston recently and I see a respectable number of blacks at rock and pop concerts.
I was teased by black peers for liking "white music", but I chalk it up to youthful ignorance. As an adult, if someone makes a silly comment like that to me, I keep it moving. Boombye.
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08/24/2011 3:24:00 AM
I am 41 years old. Back in the 80s New Edition meant nuttin to me. I was a Duranie aka a fan of Duran Duran. Over the years hip hop has slowly lost it's grip with reality...it's like a boorish rhyming catalog for the nouveaux riche. That said I have no problem letting it be known how much I love Depeche Mode, Led Zeppelin, Marc Bolan aka T. Rex, Stevie Nicks, George Michael or Spandau Ballet. Rap is everywhere so it's assumed ALL Black folks love rap and are not fans of any other genre of music. Some will take issue with your article claiming it's silly BUT the truth is music is used to keep the racial lines clearly drawn....and when you start digging 'Pour Some Sugar On Me' over 'Candy Girl' and your not a White girl...well there is a certain social firebombing going on. For the record I can take or leave 'Pour Some Sugar On Me' BUT I adore RATT's 'Round & Round' from 1984.
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Comptonhillz 08/23/2011 9:35:00 PM
with all due respect, i find the entire point you are trying to make with this article completely unreasonable. It's titled Black with white taste, but none of the artistor music you mentioned can be classified as strictly "white taste". Now if you had an undeniable love for country music, blue grass or perhaps rockabilly, then you would have a much more compelling argument, but you list Hall and Oates as the basis for your "white taste. This makes no sense because Hall and Oates were very popular on the R&B charts and were part of the "blue eyed soul" genre of soul music. They had and still do have a large black following. Just because they are white, does not mean they played "white music" (the same can be said for George Michael, Rick Astley, and Simple Red who were all very popular on the black music charts). As for your reference to Def Leopard and Poison, it can be argued that that was the popular music of the time and growing up hearing it on pop radio stations influenced your affinity towards it more than you being some musical outcast. If a white kid likes Beyonce, do they necessarily have black taste in music. I think your taste in music is not as surprising as you may think, I find it more surprising that you use it to not only pigeon hole yourself, but a lot of artist who don't necessarily consider there music "white music".
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music_lover 08/21/2011 5:53:00 AM
Why does it matter if anyone else doesn't "get" any one's individual taste in music, dating or anything else? Enjoy what you enjoy, to hell w/other's "looks", "attitudes", or petty judgements. I would have enjoyed this article more, if it was about placing more emphasis on personal enjoyment of life, than wasting time worrying about what other's think about their choices.
Where would the music world be if Chuck Berry, Little Richard, Fats Domino and later Jimi Hendrix had cared more about the color of their audience, than the music in their soul that they needed to express? FYI--each of the above is always named as a major influence on musicians from such varied genres as classic rock, pop, country, punk and metal.
Thank the musical gods that Prince, Lenny Kravitz, Jam Master J, Bad Brains, In Living Color, Tom Morello, Slash (and too many others to list)...all followed their musical aspirations regardless of race and what any nay sayers may have thought.
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tom 08/21/2011 5:12:00 AM
Seriously? Apparently you (and others, like the author) missed that Hall and Oates has long been regarded as a genre known as "blue-eyed soul"...in other words, caucasian folks who sing R&B. Back in the day, many Hall and Oates concerts were populated w/diversity (...yes, lots of black people, but other races, too). Much the way Teena Marie had a predominate "black" following.
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08/20/2011 2:30:00 PM
Hello Ms. Ford,
I'd like to say that my life was changed musically buy AC/DC's "Black in Black" album. I was working at a music store at the time in Hollywood and a lot of my coworkers were in various metal bands. I, a AfroAm young man, not quite out yet (yeah I gay too) were was raised on a smattering of r&b had already started to explore film scores but it was the "Black in Black" album that really kicked open the doors for me. Now my taste run mainly from various Electronica Dance Music to various forms of rock today and still film scores. I was taken back to my youth when you mentioned the song "Pour some sugar on me" being a single of the first album given to me by a friend because it was one of my favorite songs. I have another friend today who affectionately calls me his "Unicorn" as I was the first friend he made who was AfroAm (he a culturally, Jewish man ) and regulatory attended EDM Dance Clubs. Thank you for writing your bit of music life. I have never felt the shame you had experienced, having many friends in Hollywood, but it was never lost on me how unique I was among my fellow "Other Music" fans...
Cheeers.
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08/20/2011 2:33:00 AM
Eh, I don't know. We listened to everything in my overwhelmingly black and Latino neighborhood in New York. Our parents raised us on R&B and reggae, and we literally grew up with hip-hop. But we also listened to a grip of Top 40: Hall & Oates, Eurythmics, Culture Club, Simply Red, Wham!, Twisted Sister, Madonna, NKOTB, etc. There was even a multi-racial crew of black, Asian American, Latino and white kids in high school who were heavy into the Cure and R.E.M. and wore Doc Marten's.
No one ever got teased for their musical tastes. Perhaps it's because almost everyone listened to almost everything. But no one was EVER teased for what they liked (unless they liked P.M. Dawn or Vanilla Ice or somebody, but you SHOULD have been teased for that).
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renaissanceviking 08/19/2011 11:58:00 PM
As a black kid growing up in the valley in the 80s who was heavily into hardcore punk and british alternative (after a dalliance with old school heavy metal) and took a ton of crap from other black kids from black neighborhoods..i have to say this is right on the money. Luckily I became an adult and don't have to give a damn what someone thinks of my musical tastes..
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Ko 08/19/2011 9:22:00 PM
smh. this article is a mess.
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hmm 08/19/2011 9:15:00 PM
Intellectually dishonest? oh dear.
I think that this article is more about a personal experience, and the problem with the article is that it is making huge statements essentializing races based on her personal experience. the reason why there is such a range in comments from "why was this written?" to "it is intellectually dishonest for you to not see these as truths" is beside the point.
your being a teacher doesn't make you an expert on the black child's experience. it makes you an expert on your own perspective, teaching in your school.
Thembi is a great writer, no doubt. This article, however, could do with a rewrite (maybe changing the title and making less generalizations, i.e. speaking for Black People and White Tastes). It's not about being dismissive of racial trends in music affinities -- on the contrary, I think the author was the one who chose to write about something through tunnel vision.
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Djdex 08/19/2011 4:07:00 PM
why is this news? Google suggestion: "Detroit Techno"
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08/19/2011 1:08:00 PM
Y'all familiar with The Electrifying Mojo (The Midnight Funk Association - M.F.A.) from Detroit?
The pioneering DJ who broke Prince in Detroit, and who single-handedly got Detroit kids of all colors dancing together, playing the most eclectic playlists in radio?
Who harbored a particular love for The B-52's and Kraftwerk as well as loads of 'White' English Synth-Pop groups in the 80s (especially Depeche Mode, The Human League and New Order), which directly influenced the (Black) originators of Detroit Techno?
Read up and get schooled:
http://www.midnightfunkassociation.com/2008/11/about-the-electrifying-mojo/
He was probably America's greatest DJ. The influence he had on an entire generation of Black and White kids in Detroit was profound. I couldn't help thinking about him as I read Thembi's article.
Here's to "colorless" musical taste!
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Mic 08/19/2011 1:49:00 AM
I have to come back and disagree with many of the comments on here. I think the author made excellent observations regarding the fact that there is a stigma to being Black and openly liking so called "White music". Refuting this is intellectually dishonest and perhaps an indication that certain Black folks simply get offended by these truths.
The reality remains that your kids (Black) WILL be laughed at by their peers if they flaunted having White artists in their iPods, regardless of the genre of music on hand. This is simply a fact; And I'm a teacher, so I know this first hand. We cannot deny that there is this misplaced "you're trying to act White" syndrome whenever a Black person embraces certain things ridiculously labeled "White". I'll go further and say that Blacks are usually even more virulent in adopting these stance against another Black person, whereas the majority of Whites would probably simply ignore it.
Many attacked the author or the article on the basis that it was silly or trite, but I think the article, heavily edited or not, brings up realities that are worthy of intelligent discussion instead of dismissive posts. No point in hiding our heads in the sand. Ask your kids and you'll see how much of a stigma this really is. I do agree with the comment that said this is an issue that goes beyond music.
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assimilation 08/18/2011 11:30:00 PM
It's all good... It's all music... ...3rd attempt to share the knowledge?? Censored, blocked by frickin' monitor. Check-out "D'z" Companion Events - SHOWCASE: And OPEN MIC / JAM: every Th. nite @ HSB&G. U'z mite could learn somethin'...
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08/18/2011 10:09:00 PM
@illmami Not on urban radio. These new cats would be seriously challenged on Name that Tune. Having worked with more than a few "producers", I have had many conversations about the music they source for inspiration and / or sampling. Its so bad sometimes as producers they don't recognize an 80's Annie Lennox sample. I play the original and they look dumbfounded. I think environment and exposure play a large role too.
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08/18/2011 9:59:00 PM
Bottom line: Theres a double standard when it comes to music for Black Kids and White Kids. As usual.
White Kids head to a Hip Hop concert... that seems to be the norm. Almost expected.
Black Kids head to a Mars Volta/Blood Red Shoes and catch rude stares and race related comments.
I know it. Im that kid.
It really doesnt matter how this article turned out, Thembi put a lot of work into the article that was cut. You should be very aware of that. It seems as if LA Weekly was a bit scared to tackle the real deal behind this... Why is it such a big deal for Black people to love rock? The issue needs to be address. And it honestly not about Black people liking POP music... thats almost expected. We are speaking exactly on Rock Music and why SOME people are so shocked to find out that Black people love it. And yes.... people act shocked.
Since 90% of popular music is derivative of Ragtime, Blues and Jazz music, all traditional forms of African American music... There shouldnt be any issues when I show up at a Kaki King or COT show... that I help put together. And there is. So lets address it.
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Lena 08/18/2011 9:34:00 PM
People are trying too hard to be "race neutral" up in these comments. I thought this was charming and a voice I hadn't heard before.
Yes, morons, most people consider Hall and Oates to be a band predominantly listened to by white people. To ignore that is the musical equivalent of going "I don't see color".
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Guest 08/18/2011 8:28:00 PM
I'm going to have to agree with Elle here re: Lenny Kravitz. I remember his videos getting tons of play on BET as well as MTV when he was making more music than he does now.
I also am going to have to disagree re: Hip Hop producers largely not having the musical knowledge you speak of. Some of them don't but a lot of them do have a vast knowledge of music. I'm going to have to chalk this one up to the current climate of the music industry only allowing Hip Hop artists and producers a chance to be heard if it sounds like Weezy, Drake, or Kanye. Thank God the Auto-Tuning seems to have leveled out a bit but it's still atrocious.
I am actually the person referenced in this article as "Imani" and knowing the author personally, I can attest that this article was edited profusely so that in the end, along with the accompanying illustration of Black folks hanging listening to "white music," this topic comes off as trite and simple when it clearly is not.
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Jdub 08/18/2011 8:21:00 PM
You're not Black with white tastes. You're a person into pop music.
This article is silly.
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Jdub 08/18/2011 8:18:00 PM
You're not black with white tastes. You're a person into pop music.
This article is silly.
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Elle 08/18/2011 8:18:00 PM
LOL @ blacks don't really listen to Lenny Kravitz. Can you point me to the survey where you got that statistic?
But then again, articles like this encourage that sort of speak. In reality, if it's good music & it's popular then it should be categorized as such instead of pushed upon certain demographic groups because it's what they're "supposed" to like.
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08/18/2011 8:12:00 PM
You do realize that "black music" and "white music" is ridiculous. When I was growing up in the 80's everyone listened to Hall and Oates. Blacks don't really listen to Lenny Kravitz..is that white music? This is the reason why hip hop is in decline. The best hip hop producers used to have a deep knowledge of all of music. Rock, funk, soul, disco, etc. Now they don't have the musical knowledge or creativity to sample beyond the 80's. As a matter of fact, this article offends me! Go check out the documentary Electric Purgatory and learn something!
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A. 08/18/2011 8:10:00 PM
this article is pretty bad. you're not unique. this isn't anything new. i'm sure there were plenty of black people at a Hall and Oates concert. do you know how many times they've been sampled in hip-hop? or that the What's Happening!! tv show featured an episode about bootlegging a Doobie Brothers concert? you're exhibiting this pride of being special for not being a stereotype when there are millions of blacks who don't solely listen to hip-hop.
was this supposed to enlighten white people or something?
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Elle 08/18/2011 8:03:00 PM
I understand what you were trying to achieve w/this article & appreciate the sentiment, but I was actually expecting you to mention hair metal & yacht rock groups or... I don't know, not popular music. It diminishes your point in my opinion to say that you were unique in liking Hall & Oates or NKOTB when both groups are universally-known platinum-selling artists. As mentioned in the comments, it would be on par w/a white person saying that they were breaking the mold by listening to Michael Jackson or Stevie Wonder, artists that, while African-American, were popular with many demographics.
I also think that black people struggling to find an identity in American culture where many things are labelled as "white" is a worthwhile topic that does need to be examined further, but I think that it goes a lot further than music.
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08/18/2011 8:00:00 PM
the article was written because its about time that we address that many black people love rock music. preferably over Hip Hop. and frankly, some of us are tired of rolling to concerts and catching funny looks or being judged over it. by both black and white people.
great article.
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hmm 08/18/2011 6:42:00 PM
Sorry to say it, but I have to agree with a majority of the comments -- not sure why this was an article, let alone a feature. This is an exclamation from the mountaintops that falls flat for two reasons: 1) I thought that calling soft rock "white music" went out ages ago, and 2) black people have been listening to whatever they wanted without the melodramatic coming out of the closet all the while.
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08/18/2011 6:31:00 PM
Im not sure why you wrote this article, Hall and Oates and Steley Dan, & Doobie brothers are R&B groups, but because they're white ( by race, not music) they get categorized as a pop, or adult contemporary.
They were more soulful than most Black groups that were listed as R&B like parliament Funkadelic and Nona Hedrix who would tend to lean more rock ( case in point P-Funks Knee Deep number one on the R&B charts for months had a four minute lead rock guitar solo in the middle of it).
So basically you're writing this saying you and your black friends went and saw an R&B group....wow thats news.
This is kind of sad because If a white person would have written a story saying he went to a Public Enemy concert ( and most PE concerts were 50% white across the country) and wrote an article to celebrate his/her new realism that music really has no race category we would view it as just another unhip white corny writer that just found out something most have known about for decades, well as a black man I feel that about you.
glad you enjoyed the show.
but I hope you didnt watch the show thinking you were different than anyone else because you were black and you were there.
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08/18/2011 5:33:00 PM
Great article.
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Mic 08/18/2011 5:10:00 PM
I was both annoyed and delighted by your article. I'm Black as well, and will not accept being pigeon-holed in any category of music. I like all the White artists you mentioned and many more, from The Police to Maroon 5, Bjork to Frank Sinatra, Daft Punk to Aerosmith and everything in between. I just like good music regardless of who makes it.
Black music is in my blood, but I also hate a lot of post-funk Black music for the simple reason that NKOTB were not the only group to play a dish-water version of R&B. A bunch of Black "artists" stunk as well, including many in the hip-hop/rap genre.
I lament the fact that Black people tend to be closed-minded musically to the point where they reject their own musical heritage and allow other people to take it over. There is no Rock, Disco, Industrial/Goth or anything else without Black music at the root of it, let alone today's dance-pop styles that are 100% Black music, which Black folks regard as White music! It's ridiculous. I was even at a club a few years back, and the DJ played Slim Shady by Eminem, and all the Blacks walked off the dance floor in disgust. I couldn't believe it. This was a pure Dr. Dre JAM, but because this White dude is on the cover, it bounces any less?? Come on...
At the end of the day, we're the ones losing by putting ourselves in a narrower and narrower box instead of claiming what's ours. Pretty soon, Black folks won't have any decent music left they can call their own because they're so tunnel-visioned. Just look at the mediocrity that is played on Black radio these days. We have succeeded in cornering Black music into less and less creative formats instead of giving it its full span and glory.
All that to say that I fully relate to your article, and even though I have never been musically peer-pressured, it touched a raw nerve with me.
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Joey96t 08/18/2011 5:08:00 PM
All this and no mention of Living Colour... Vernon Reid IMO probably one of the most slept on guitarist of our time...
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Music Patron 08/18/2011 1:51:00 PM
It's all music. Check-out the herstorically diverse "Companion Events" DOLORES PETERSEN Presents: SHOWCASE: And OPEN MIC / JAM: every Th. night @ HSB&G.
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Abby 08/18/2011 9:43:00 AM
Ha! This reminds me back in college in Phllly, I would see Questlove at punk/indie shows all the time. Music is for everybody!