Truck vs. Church and State: Kogi Bites Back

A A A Comments (7) By L.A. Weekly readers Wednesday, Dec 16 2009

Kogi Beatdown!
Wow! Little did our Squid Ink food blog editor, Amy Scattergood, know what she was getting into when she asked Church and State chef Walter Manzke a simple question, “Is there anything you won’t eat?” Manzke answered thusly and in the process set off a mini commentary storm: “Anything off a truck. L.A. seems to get caught up in these trends, when one person has great success with something and then no one can come up with anything new so they just copy it. And the most ridiculous one seems to be the truck. I mean, it was maybe cool when the first person did it, and it fits the economy because it’s cheap to operate and all that, but I think it’s everything that takes away from the purpose, the enjoyment and the passion of eating.”

That brought this retort from Papi, Kogi Familia, the Streets of L.A., who writes: “There is a profound place for fine dining, technique and ingredients. I know, I have been there in those kitchens for many years. But where do you get the balls to go off on street food, trucks and spontaneous eating like you are some friggin saint?

“I’ve eaten at your place twice and I wanted to give you props for working in the kitchen during service, but your food ain’t THAT good for you to be talking smack!

“I come from the streets, yet I’ve cooked for kings and queens. But in the streets, there is a code. When you talk smack, be ready for the beatdown!

“The food you talk about and try to cook is extremely secular and exclusive. I got homies that will never be able to eat squid ink or sea salt, does that mean they are not entitled to eat great food? Does food have to be only in the context of European-laced aristocratic thinking?

“Come down to the Kogi truck and let me show you a little magic and change your opinion on things a bit. Or maybe I’ll just park my ride right in front of Church and State and say whassup!”

To Walter’s rescue comes David Haskell, and we’ll just get out of the way here: “First off, Walter is one of the classiest guys in the world. Now, in terms of chefs he is one of the most dedicated and best in the city. To attack him is just classless. He didn’t say your tacos suck or you suck ... he stated that he thinks it’s a bad fad. You picked a fight with a guy who actually gave you a compliment. He said the first trucks were innovative. Saying you will give him a beatdown and you are from the streets ... Okay, tough guy ... relax. No drive-bys with that crazy truck of yours.”

Lizzie tries to mediate: “Kogi rides again! I was going to say to Walter that, although I adore your food at Bastide in the past and now at Church and State, there are many ways to enjoy and share food. One of my most pleasurable evenings of the year was sharing Kogi at Golden Gopher with about 10 people, all hunched over our food and cocktails, everyone taking a bite of someone else’s food. Naturally, that was when I was still willing to patronize Kogi.

“One of the things I love about L.A. is the access to amazing food, high- and low-end culinary approaches. And the gastrotrucks give people who would never have the funds to finance a restaurant a chance to get out there and show their chops. I love your food, man. But don’t be so elitist.”

Maddy, meanwhile, hits Papi with some good old-fashioned smackback: “Instead of trying to “lay the smack down” on one of L.A.’s nicest and most talented chefs, why don’t you worry about yourself and start serving good food. I’ve given you two chances and my hard-earned cash. So I’m going to put it out there: Kogi. Is. NOT. GOOD.

“Your waits are excruciating. Thirty minutes the first time, one hour the second. This would be fine if I were getting the best taco of my life. Instead I get some dried out pork in soggy tortillas topped with “kimchi” (not really) and a “Pac-man” burger with a burnt (read: BLACK) bun.

“I respect you for being an innovator in the biz. But if you feel you have to attack others to defend your food, and not let your food speak for itself, well I certainly have no problem calling you out on your flaws.”

Finally, it all comes back around to Papi, who offers a little balance: “That’s enough ... I said some things out of passion in response to Walter using strong words like hate for taco trucks. Our soul at Kogi is to feed the streets at the cheapest price. We are not perfect. I just couldn’t figure out how food could be hated or classified when it was doing good for people trying to make a living and nourishing people after a hard day of making a living.

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Dave 12/27/2009 6:06:00 AM

Food shouldn't be a racial issue, but our experiences are based on our race. You white folks won't understand how we eat in the "hood", and we won't understand how you eat in "beverly hills". Our food is our culture, attack our food and you are attacking our culture. So much to explain, but really ya'll just need to relax and just be GLAD that Kogi and Church & State are around to give you the chance to taste their food. If you don't like either/or, then that is your entitled opinion. Now I'm gonna have to try both to see what the hubbub is all about. Kim chee tacos aren't appealing to me, and another place with sea bass drowned in sauce? Or you can really go there and try to enjoy it for what it is, at both locations.
angelinoinseattle 12/24/2009 10:56:00 AM

It is Armando the above posters type of thinking that is just flawed. You have obviously never lived outside of Los Angeles. For you to say that food should be restricted by culture or race is just absurd. Its called smart business. Take a great product, make it better and advertise. And for your information, its not just adding pickles to a taco. Kogi makes Korean short rib tacos as well. I am so tired of people hiding behind race when they have nothing else. I am poor because I am black, or oppressed because I am latino. Those koreans that you talk about that only have signs in korean. Guess what? Drop by any latin neighborhood and the signs are in spanish. Those people are usually first generation immigrants. Guess what they came here looking for a better life as we all did, including the pilgrims. What happens is that your kids grow up speaking english and becoming american. So please dont turn food into a race issue because thats just wrong. If someone makes a dish better I dont care who they are people will go there to eat it. Btw I am latin too.
Armando 12/22/2009 2:08:00 PM

The taco truck has been a part of Los Angeles for many years, and just like the guy pushing his raspado cart it won't go away any time soon. For many years Latinos had a niche in this for of food service. Unfortunately some people with more money and more social networks managed to step in and start selling the same thing, but in news and sleeker looking trucks. Now the lunch truck is as ubiquitous as teenagers walking around with cute little chihuahuas and celebrities adopting children. Yes, some people see it as the next big thing, the one thing they don't realize is that people who had been working in their own little trucks making a daily living have been pushed aside. Two years ago there were a total of two to three lunch trucks that speckled Wilshire from La Brea all the way down to Fairfax, but now there are around eight to ten of them competing for customers. I would really buy a taco from one of those places, but my better jjudgmenttells me that the money isn't going back to the community it is claiming to represent, the Latino community. Why not sell your own original dishes at cheap prices? Why call it fusion food when they make tacos and simply add their own hot sauce or substituting pickled cabbage for pickled chili and onion. The only time I've seem a Korean owned restaurant or food catering company advertise in English is when they take something from another community and sell it. If one goes to KoKorea townost restaurants only advertise in Korean because they only want to cater to their people. No decent, hardworking person that has been working in the lunch truck industry for more than ten years will tell someone else that they will park their truck in front of their restaurant, or that the antagonist of the argument is going get a beat down. Only someone who claims to be from the streets and has any connection to organized crime makes remarks like that in Los Angeles. People who are from the streets know when to speak with intention and when to let things go by. I doubt that the city of Los Angeles will let taco trucks park at random on different streets on different nights. I am pretty sure that some type of city ordinance will be passed, which will most likely not have its desired effect, and instead will further marginalize the people who've been doing this for a much longer time. In the end the fad might pass or might remain, but the people who really are making an honest living will always be working out of their lunch trucks in the middle of the night in a no name street next to a no name highway, around the corner of a no name neighborhood of Los Angeles, and these folks will not only be catering to Latinos, but will continue to make the best and most original tacos of Los Angeles. Rarely does a legend arise from imitating others, instead a person, by being original and forging his own path can become a legendary figure. I wonder who'll start selling fusion tamales.
mike 12/20/2009 8:54:00 AM

im gonna have to side with the church and state guys here. it is just plain stupid to wait an hour to an hour and a half for a two dollar taco that can sometimes be good but nowhere compares to anything a real mexican taco truck has to offer. i can just pour some kimchi on any mexican taco and it'd be the same thing so what's the big deal? okay so kogi was new but that was like last year.
Israel 12/19/2009 11:50:00 PM

Eating food off of a truck in Los Angeles is anything but a fad. I grew up eating mexican food from the ubiquitous taco trucks around the city, not giving any thought to it. The classic suburban lunch truck has also been a constant memory visiting my mom at work when i was little. If anything can be called a fad, it is the addition to traditional truck items such as regular "American" fare, tacos, and burritos, of more foreign cuisine fused with the mexican and american food. But why term it a fad and not just recognize it as an important new development in the evolution of a Los Angeles style of "cuisine"? I'm wondering why it wasn't thought of earlier? And if it didn't happen now with Kogi, it was bound to happen in the future. The intersection of the Latino and Korean communities is hard to miss in Koreatown. The cuisines were bound to be combined in this city at one point or another. And what better mode of delivery than the classic Los Angeles lunch truck. As for the larger question of numerous other styles of food being served off a truck, why not? Like I said before, I'm surprised no one thought of it earlier. The lunch truck has been around for decades and its incarnation as a purveyor of mexican food for nearly as long. The question should be, "Why did it take this long to begin serving every other manner of food possible?" I still want to try Church and State and as for the chef who made the remark, I just want to know what his problem is? I've got no problem with him and I'm sure most people in Los Angeles who simply eat to enjoy good food have no problem with him. If this chef is an LA local, he is not much of an LA local and betrays a disturbing disregard and ignorance for and of the various quirks and histories of his city. If he is not a local, he should simply get out more and eat where the people who enjoy good food eat. He could learn a few things from Jonathan Gold as well. Israel of Encino, originally from Van Nuys
Dave 12/19/2009 7:54:00 PM

These are 2 different providers of food. Kogi feeding the masses and Church and State feeding those who can afford them. Chef basically attacking trucks that have been around for decades here in L.A., Kogi reacting to those comments. BOTH are vying for customers, so really in these tough economic times BOTH these guys are saying/doing what they need to do to promote their businesses. I haven't eaten at either, but I do like it that they are BOTH in existence here in L.A. People need to relax and be glad we have people trying to stay open for biz today.
Angelinoinseattle 12/17/2009 2:22:00 PM

I had to comment here because Koji Taco trucks imo are great. They are always worth the wait for me. Some people like them and some dont. But lets be real here there would not be one hour waits if the food wasnt good. My hats go off to these guys. I would never eat off a Roach Coach after getting sick twice. But these guys have changed my mind. You can get great food off a truck. Maybe I am not a fine dining sort of guy. My tastes are pretty middle class. There is nothing about squid ink or quail eggs that make me want to eat them. Some people do and thats okay too. Right now Im living in seattle. I come home once every 3 months and the first thing I do is head for a Koji truck, followed the next day by a trip to Portos Bakery in Glendale. When you go to a koji truck expect to wait a while. Second come with a open mind, dont expect a orgasm in your mouth off the first bite. Lastly what to expect, great food at a cheap price from some hardworking people. Damn I miss LA.