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LPB 01/06/2009 1:55:00 AM
What is it with these low-IQs who have to keep posting
(Gotcha!)
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LPB 01/06/2009 1:54:00 AM
What is it with these low-IQs who have to keep posting the same comment over and over again?
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alex morfesis 01/02/2009 10:17:00 AM
wow, hate comes in all shapes and sizes...but why drag in (no pun intended) lorraine hansberry into your miopic view of the world. That she was a writer does her a disservice. She came to New York to work against apartheid, as paul robeson's paper "freedom" was the only force talking about the insanity of general smuts and his crew in south africa. How disturbing that she would be lowered by you as some visual acceptance of your ideals. This was a great woman who did not have to do anything in life except count her money and she chose instead to make a difference. How dare you lower her to satisfy your personal ego. And how ironic the building bill clinton chose to put his office in on 125th street makes no mention of her or the work against apartheid done there...
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Derrick Mathis 01/02/2009 2:32:00 AM
Here's the link to my take on Mr. Ehrenstein's insanity:
http://tinyurl.com/7tsl74
Happy New Year!
~DM aka Uncle Fatlips
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David Ehrenstein 01/01/2009 6:23:00 PM
"You who is"? I rest my case.
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True Voice 12/31/2008 9:23:00 PM
David,
I think it is you who is the Magic Negro. The little puppet spouting what the Right Wing Nuts want to hear. Limpballs is using your name to chastise our new president. He is blaming you for the Magic Negro CD. You are the Step and Fetchit for the Man. Do you vote Republiklan? Now the racists on various websites are pointing to YOU saying, "Dont blame Limpy. Blame the original Magic Negro. He said it first."
Do you like your 15 minutes of fame? Are you milking this to the max?
You are the House Magic Negro for the Republiklans. Now go step and fetchit! The Republiklans will give you your 30 pieces of silver later!!
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True Voice 12/31/2008 9:20:00 PM
David,
I think it is you who is the Magic Negro. The little puppet spouting what the Right Wing Nuts want to hear. Limpballs is using your name to chastise our new president. He is blaming you for the Magic Negro CD. You are the Step and Fetchit for the Man. Do you vote Republiklan? Now the racists on various websites are pointing to YOU saying, "Dont blame Limpy. Blame the original Magic Negro. He said it first."
Do you like your 15 minutes of fame? Are you milking this to the max?
You are the House Magic Negro for the Republiklans. Now go step and fetchit! The Republiklans will give you your 30 pieces of silver later!!
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David Ehrenstein 12/31/2008 9:03:00 PM
Apples and oranges? It's fruit salad! Read what I wrote again. Carefully. And the fact that you don't know who I am isn't my failing. I have been a published journalist since 1965. "Google" is your friend.
The "divisiveness" of which you speak does not proceed from me but from those who choose not to remember history.
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A.Jackson 12/31/2008 1:14:00 PM
Mr. Ehrenstein:
Thank you for your response to my comment. Under the circumstances, I humbly apologize for questioning your qualifications to talk on this subject.
That said, your response further validates my point about your article. Without you stating so, I would have had no clue as to your sexual orientation...but if I saw you walking down the street, my guess is there would be little doubt as to your racial background. Comparing the Gay/lesbian civil rights movement to the African-American civil rights movement is like comparing apples and oranges. They are 2 different issues with completely different social dynamics.
Part of the problem is that people in the media (like yourself) have been using the Prop 8 issue to create divisiveness. As you should know, the African American community has been resentful of many in the Jewish community for years for equating their civil rights struggles with ours. Now, the Gay/lesbian community seems to be taking a similar approach without considering how African Americans FEEL about it, then condemming us as bigots if we don't automatically go along with that agenda. This is the aspect of this issue that Ms. Cannick seems to understand, in my opinion.
Barack Obama's choice of Mr Warren to speak at his inaguration is consistent with his philosophy of inclusiveness of ALL opinions, even those he doesn't agree with himself. To me, he is a "visionary' who is trying to bring this country together by giving EVERYONE a voice. Your article casts a negative spin by marginalizing him as an "all-too-typical African-American heterosexual"...a judegmental stance that would NOT be appreciated by the James Baldwins, Bayard Rustins and Marlon Riggs of the world. Maybe you were not trying to consciously do this; I think you were just speaking from a perspective of reactionary frustration. But here is some food for thought; if I read these implications into your article, you can be sure that others did too.
Here's hoping that the HUMAN race can come together in a POSITIVE way as we enter a new year (and a new administration)...peace my brother...
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David Ehrenstein 12/30/2008 10:49:00 PM
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/David_Ehrenstein
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David Ehrenstein 12/30/2008 9:04:00 PM
Mr. Jackson I AM African-American.
And gay.
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A. Jackson 12/30/2008 12:37:00 PM
I am an African American heterosexual male. I voted against Proposition 8, and strongly support its' overturn. I am a Christian and I do not believe in same-sex "marriage" but I DO support equal rights and benefits for same-sex couples (much as Barack Obama advocates).
I must take issue with Mr. Ehrenstein on his inference that because of Obama's presidency, African Americans have "flipped the script" on the race issue and are all a bunch of gay-hating bigots. I must assume that, based on his name, Mr Ehrenstein is NOT African American, and since he does not divulge his sexual preference, I cannot imagine why he thinks he is qualified to speak on these issues. His comments about Jasmine Cannick's L.A. Times editorial (which, in my humble opinion, is the best read on Black opposition to Prop. 8 published anywhere to date) are slanted to support his opinions. Presented fairly, Mr. Ehrenstein would have mentioned the most important point (at least from the African American perspective).
Race, unlike religious affiliation or sexual orientation, CAN NOT BE HIDDEN. Citing a personal experience, I lived with a man for 2 years before I discovered his homosexuality. Certainly, a gay or lesbian can stay "in the closet" to avoid discrimination (and in NO WAY am I advocating this, just making my point), much as a person of the Jewish or Muslim faith can deny their religion to avoid harassment. However, to quote an old Southern expression, "Black don't wash off". It is MUCH EASIER to discriminate against someone when you know WHAT THEY ARE when you see them coming (as Women and other minority groups can attest to). Suffice it to say that, unless you are confronted by drunks in a parking lot calling you the N-word because your date is of another race, or you have rocks thrown at you as you jog through a predominately White neighborhood, or had people lock their car doors when you walk to a street corner, you should NOT be equating your cause (worthy as it may be) with the African American experience.
A recent episode of "South Park" illustrated this point perfectly. Ashamed that his father had used the N-word on a national television show, Stan attempted to apologize to the show's only African American character (aptly named "Token") on several occasions, only to be rejected with the admonition "You just don't get it". Finally, at the end of the show Stan understood the concept that because he was NOT African American, he would NEVER "get it". Although African Americans are largely supportive of the Gay/Lesbian civil right struggle, suggesting that the two movements are somehow the same will continue to be a divisive point between both groups. THIS is the part, Mr Ehrenstein, that you DO NOT GET.
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blake 12/29/2008 7:52:00 PM
David,
Black is not the new white. Since a white man convicted of a felonly has a better chance of getting a job than a African-American with a college degree and no criminal history in New York there is no real comparison.
Be real about the racism in the gay community. It's there right? Why? Because it is a microcosm of our society. So, why would we expect that there would not be any kind of homophobia in non-white communities? The bigotry is based in religion.
Just because Barack Obama has been elected president does not suddenly make entrenched, institutional racism a thing of the past. Oprah's been a billionaire for how long? Did blacks become the new whites then?
Moreover, while I agree with your anger at Obama's choice of Warren, I do not think Obama chose to deliberately hurt gay people with the selection any more so than he did try to offend African-Americans by choosing Hillary Clinton after she ran a vicious, anti-black racist campaign. Neither do I feel that Obama tried piss off progressives by keeping Joe Lieberman in the tent.
Frankly, I wonder if Obama may feel that times are desperate and that he has to make nice with some despicable people in a time of crisis. Frankly, if Obama can play kissy-face with Rick Warren and leverage that relationship to get ENDA, the Matthew Sheppard Hate Crimes legislation, federal civil union legislation and repeal of the DADT then hallelujah!
What kind of shennanigans did Lyndon Johnson have to pull to get Civil Right legislation passed? A lot.
Agnim,
You are an ass. There is no such thing as a unified African culture any more than there is a unified European or Asian culture. Africa is a continent. You offer no proof of African exceptionalism to experiencing homosexuality. Instead, you offer chauvinistic dribble.
Moreover, your racist invective about David's European ancestry is disgusting and an insult to the majority of African-Americans because every major genetic survey shows that the average has 8 to 22% European DNA. The fact that you would attack David based on his genes shows both your lack of understanding of genetics and your low moral character.
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Mr. Rewrite 12/28/2008 11:44:00 PM
Kimba: Well-said. I hope everyone will take the time to look for Kimba's comment above mine. Rather than add more to the fire, I think we would do well to read what she wrote and reflect on it.
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Clearsky54 12/28/2008 7:21:00 PM
Absolutely great article. I agree with all the writer's observations and comments. The article was too short; I wanted more; I hope there will be more. "Warrengate" needs to be followed in vivid detail until its ignominious end.
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Junky 12/28/2008 7:35:00 AM
I can't believe that stupid Yahoo allow the your title to be listed on their page. NO WONDER STUPID YAHOO IS GOING DOWN TO THE TOILET
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Agnim 12/28/2008 4:32:00 AM
"Black is the new white"?
What da fcuk! lol
Little David, you know nothing of African people and African culture, 'cept for the lies and misrepresentations that your eurocentric lineage has brainwashed in you.
Don't be fooled by your 'one drop' of Black blood. lol
Do some rigorous scientific investigation into African culture; and you will find --- Homosexuality WAS NEVER a representative behavior in indigenous African culture. Africans were never that gender confused, as too many unfortunate people are today.
The African is the First Man, and has been around for THOUSANDS of generations!
If homosexual BEHAVIOR was natural or normal, then African people would have evolved the perverted behavior by now, in representative samples of their many cultures.
Yet, throughout the long history of African indigenous societies, to this day, homosexual BEHAVIOR has NEVER been condoned nor promoted as 'government' policy, by any representative samples of African ethnic groups.
The truth is: Homosexual TENDENCY is a birth/behavioral defect!
And homosexual BEHAVIOR is a societally-worthless behavior, which has no redeeming social value and which poses additional risk to the children and to the weaker minds in the society.
Society cannot persecute or prosecute a citizen merely for having a tendency, however acquired.
However, any society that would be remain viable and healthy, WILL have the responsibility and obligation to regulate the BEHAVIOR of its members.
The condoning and promoting of homosexual BEHAVIOR, serves neither the unfortunate and mentally mixed up individual nor the society.
Seeking to demonize African people in America for not going along with the homosexual deviance WILL NOT succeed; because African Americans are going along what is deeply rooted in their very genes for THOUSANDS OF GENERATIONS -- male-female copulation as the ONLY form of mating!
Little David, I feel your pain. Not only are you gender mixed up and confused.
You are ALSO ethnically mixed up and confused.
The last flaw, we can blame on the hormonal-driven parents who never consider the plight of an offspring that would be ethnically mixed up offspring.
Obama may be ethnically mixed up; but unlike you, he picks a side and immerse himself in the African culture of his father. You are a nowhere man, BOTH in terms of gender and ethnicity.
And you delude yourself that your 'one drop' of Black blood allows you the liberty to victimize African Americans again over sexual perversion. NOT!
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Agnim 12/28/2008 4:31:00 AM
"Black is the new white"?
What da fcuk! lol
Little David, you know nothing of African people and African culture, 'cept for the lies and misrepresentations that your eurocentric lineage has brainwashed in you.
Don't be fooled by your 'one drop' of Black blood. lol
Do some rigorous scientific investigation into African culture; and you will find --- Homosexuality WAS NEVER a representative behavior in indigenous African culture. Africans were never that gender confused, as too many unfortunate people are today.
The African is the First Man, and has been around for THOUSANDS of generations!
If homosexual BEHAVIOR was natural or normal, then African people would have evolved the perverted behavior by now, in representative samples of their many cultures.
Yet, throughout the long history of African indigenous societies, to this day, homosexual BEHAVIOR has NEVER been condoned nor promoted as 'government' policy, by any representative samples of African ethnic groups.
The truth is: Homosexual TENDENCY is a birth/behavioral defect!
And homosexual BEHAVIOR is a societally-worthless behavior, which has no redeeming social value and which poses additional risk to the children and to the weaker minds in the society.
Society cannot persecute or prosecute a citizen merely for having a tendency, however acquired.
However, any society that would be remain viable and healthy, WILL have the responsibility and obligation to regulate the BEHAVIOR of its members.
The condoning and promoting of homosexual BEHAVIOR, serves neither the unfortunate and mentally mixed up individual nor the society.
Seeking to demonize African people in America for not going along with the homosexual deviance WILL NOT succeed; because African Americans are going along what is deeply rooted in their very genes for THOUSANDS OF GENERATIONS -- male-female copulation as the ONLY form of mating!
Little David, I feel your pain. Not only are you gender mixed up and confused.
You are ALSO ethnically mixed up and confused.
The last flaw, we can blame on the hormonal-driven parents who never consider the plight of an offspring that would be ethnically mixed up offspring.
Obama may be ethnically mixed up; but unlike you, he picks a side and immerse himself in the African culture of his father. You are a nowhere man, BOTH in terms of gender and ethnicity.
And you delude yourself that your 'one drop' of Black blood allows you the liberty to victimize African Americans again over sexual perversion. NOT!
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Agnim 12/28/2008 4:03:00 AM
"Black is the new white"?
What da fcuk! lol
Little David, you know nothing of African people and African culture, 'cept for the lies and misrepresentations that your eurocentric lineage has brainwashed in you.
Don't be fooled by your 'one drop' of Black blood. lol
Do some rigorous scientific investigation into African culture; and you will find --- Homosexuality WAS NEVER a representative behavior in indigenous African culture. Africans were never that gender confused, as too many unfortunate people are today.
The African is the First Man, and has been around for THOUSANDS of generations!
If homosexual BEHAVIOR was natural or normal, then African people would have evolved the perverted behavior by now, in representative samples of their many cultures.
Yet, throughout the long history of African indigenous societies, to this day, homosexual BEHAVIOR has NEVER been condoned nor promoted as 'government' policy, by any representative samples of African ethnic groups.
The truth is: Homosexual TENDENCY is a birth/behavioral defect!
And homosexual BEHAVIOR is a societally-worthless behavior, which has no redeeming social value and which poses additional risk to the children and to the weaker minds in the society.
Society cannot persecute or prosecute a citizen merely for having a tendency, however acquired.
However, any society that would be remain viable and healthy, WILL have the responsibility and obligation to regulate the BEHAVIOR of its members.
The condoning and promoting of homosexual BEHAVIOR, serves neither the unfortunate and mentally mixed up individual nor the society.
Seeking to demonize African people in America for not going along with the homosexual deviance WILL NOT succeed; because African Americans are going along what is deeply rooted in their very genes for THOUSANDS OF GENERATIONS -- male-female copulation as the ONLY form of mating!
Little David, I feel your pain. Not only are you gender mixed up and confused.
You are ALSO ethnically mixed up and confused.
The last flaw, we can blame on the hormonal-driven parents who never consider the plight of an offspring that would be ethnically mixed up offspring.
Obama may be ethnically mixed up; but unlike you, he picks a side and immerse himself in the African culture of his father. You are a nowhere man, BOTH in terms of gender and ethnicity.
And you delude yourself that your 'one drop' of Black blood allows you the liberty to victimize African Americans again over sexual perversion. NOT!
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John T 12/27/2008 11:51:00 PM
Rev Warren simply believes what the bible says. Period.
No, he doesn't. In fact just the other day I saw him on TV wearing a shirt that was clearly a cotton/polyester blend, which I'm sure you know is against God's law (Leviticus 19:19). God hates mixed fibers!
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carl matthes 12/27/2008 8:48:00 PM
There's enough discrimination, hate and bigotry (DHB) around for everyone to have their fair share. We all share in the success of President-elect Obama, skin color and sexual orientation aside. Since all of us suffer when DHB triumphs it's up to each of us to recognize when we practice it. Ask the blackest black if lighter blacks discriminate against them. Ask the most effete gay man if he is discriminated against and hated by the "pass for straight" gay man. I am a recently married California gay white man, Obama has never embraced same-sex marriage. Therefore, he is not like Bill Clinton, who actually promised one thing and did another. Obama did promise diversity and is reaching out. Well, guess what. He's reaching out to Warren. The outstanding gay black folk you mention in your article lived their lives to produce enlightenment and promote understanding. A great goal. Your article, David, was outstanding. Your conclusion, though, is a bit flippant. A judgment that it would only take the 60 days since the election of Obama to make blacks into the new whites diminishes the 400 years of practice us whites have had.
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David Ehrenstein 12/27/2008 6:36:00 PM
He's YOUR President , S. Anthony. He's made it quite clear that he's not mine -- being that I'm gay and black.
I'm just an expendable commodity to him. And less than human to you and Rick Warren
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S Anthony 12/27/2008 1:53:00 PM
what a surprise, more bashing of religion by people afraid of it. Rev Warren simply believes what the bible says. Period. You dont have to
agree with him, but he's consistent with millions of, according to you, homophobic republican fox news racists? Prop 8 failed primarily due to hispanic and african americans FAITH. Not bigotry or homophobia. Rev Warren EASILY loves and respects more people of all types of religion, political persuasion, and points of view than the writer of this column, or most liberals in the US. Simply being intolerant of republicans qualifies
most dems as less compassionate than Rev Warren. Most people in this world and country have faith. Yet the HUGE minority of gays seems to feel its OK to harass, ridicule and mock the majority faith communities of the world? Unbelievably narrow minded thinking. Obama is ALL of our president, and if he want's to be re-elected, he will govern as such. So far, so good Mr President \ elect.
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Kimba 12/27/2008 2:25:00 AM
Hmmmm...I have to say as an African American woman, Obama supporter and a supporter of gay rights, this was an interesting choice for Obama to make....
I can say I don't agree with his choice to have someone so prejudicial be a part of such a momentous event, but let's remember, the White House was a slave house so we're already doing better than our ancestors.
BUT I do not think that Black is the new White, seriously that's pushing the envelope a bit far... I think Obama like many other Presidents, is going to make choices some of us won't agree with, but as long as he TRIES to do better than the nightmare we call the Bush era, I'm going to give him a chance.
And yes, I do think the Black community is overly zealous in it's anti-gay crap that it spews BUT that is one of many issues in the Black community...why is it people of other races have trauma in their lives, they go to a shrink..Black people tend to not do that...WHY we've obviously got issues just like everyone else..and there are plenty more issues like that that the Black community has yet to tackle. Being homophobic is just one of the many I'm sorry to say.
I guess I'm just saying, let Obama get in office and let him do some WORK before we start trippin' on every move he makes...
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Mark Groubert 12/26/2008 2:11:00 AM
David: Thank you! Absolutely brilliant analysis. Wish it was longer. The Cannick thing blew my mind the first time I read her Op-ed and then heard her soon after on Talk of the Nation. You have really boiled this thing down to its roots. Keep up the good work. There might be a book in this but definately a longer piece. Look how quickly the layers of the Obama Onion are being peeled away. What a shame.
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AFRIMERICAN 12/25/2008 5:48:00 AM
I remmeber when the L.A. Weekly, under Jay Levine was aquality, even -if-dysfunctional paper that had quality writers that wrote from a stand of journalistic integrity to attack the points, and/or failures of a partucular subject.
This article is an attack on an individual, as well as a veiled act of racism against Afrimericans/Blacks.
That the LBGT crowd would consider Afrimericans/Black willing, and unquestioned allies for gay marriage is ludicris(?) because to be hate purely on skin tone has no connection with the behavior, and lifestyle, and etc... that is attributed to the LBGT community, in fact, in most cases, were it not flaunted, no one would know or care.
Blacks cannot not be Black in that sense.
Additionally, lets look at the support the LBGT community has given Afrimericans. This community is very prominent, and powerful in Hollywood film, television, and music circles yet in nearly every movie of a violent nature, the Black always gets killed first, that's not support. In music genres that use to be all, or nearly all Black have become all white with Blcks having to ascribe to a twisted version to garner a contract or radio play, and the LBGT community has a very high influential hand in that, and in keeping Afrimericans marginalized, or limited.
I could go and on, but in short, Afrimericans/Blacks did not vote for or against the iniative out of hat, or prejudice, but out of an educated upbringing that marriage is between male and female.
Also, married or not LBGT can still claim and exercise all rights of any other type of partnership so they are losing nothing
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dave�� 12/24/2008 6:31:00 PM
Always a treat! All the best in the New Year!